Kudos, Jolly Roger

In article <C5744282.21CFD%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:

> In article 2008122109510516807-xxx@yyyzzz, gtr at xxx.RemoveThis@yyy.zzz wrote on
> 12/21/08 12:51 PM:
>
> > On 2008-12-20 11:49:17 -0800, Fred Moore <fmoore.RemoveThis@gcfn.org> said:
> >
> > I
> > don't believe, lame as it is, that Bud is made with rice. I toured the
> > production faciliy of Coors at Golden, and there was no rice in the
> > process. And for the most part they are the same beer as far as I'm
> > concerned.
>
> Au contraire. Most American beer -- at least from the major breweries,
> including Anheuser-Busch -- are made with 30-40% rice or corn instead of the
> 100% malted barley/wheat/rye grains used by most of the "craft"
> microbreweries.

Citation please?

--
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In article
<nospam.m-m-0738F0.13585021122008.DeleteThis@cpe-76-190-186-198.neo.res.rr.com>,
M-M <nospam.m-m.DeleteThis@ny.more> wrote:

> To me it's all in the alcohol content. There are some very fine Belgian
> ales- I like Piraat. It's 10.5%.

It's actually pretty hard to make a beer that strong, most yeasts (can
you blame them) do not like living in such a brew. Of course, they would
likely use well adapted yeasts and perhaps slightly higher temps than
normal to brew, and there are a few things to encourage the blighters to
keep dividing...

Interestingly, these strong beers, like wine, can improve with age!

Too strong for most folk though, imagine how dangerous a bunch of
truckies drinking some schooners of that could be.

There is *much more* to taste than alcohol though. But I agree that
often the taste is better with higher alcohol beers (within limits). For
example, Coopers red is 5.8 and the green is 4.5, both pretty good as
far as commercial beer go, but the red simply has more taste. One reason
likely is there is more malt content, so more to supply the flavours
that count.

--
dorayme

On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 03:43:23 -0600, Jolly Roger wrote (in article
<jollyroger-D7ED2E.03432222122008.DeleteThis@news.individual.net>):

[in response to the following assertion]

>> Au contraire. Most American beer -- at least from the major breweries,
>> including Anheuser-Busch -- are made with 30-40% rice or corn instead of
>> the 100% malted barley/wheat/rye grains used by most of the "craft"
>> microbreweries.
>
> Citation please?

I found the following at
<http://supportyourlocalbrewery.com/CraftBeerFactSheet_9_06.pdf>.


Craft Beers: Generally, ³all-malt,² domestic beers produced using 100 percent
malted barley by small brewers. Craft beers that are not all-malt sometimes
substitute a percentage of malted wheat (for wheat beers) or malted rye (for
rye beers) or other fermentable ingredients intended to enhance flavor. Their
inspiration can be traced to British, German or Belgian traditions or is
often uniquely American. Craft beers range from pale to dark in color and
from mild to strong in alcohol content. Sometimes they include unusual
ingredients such as fruit, herbs or spices. Compared with other beers, their
emphasis is more on flavor, and less on appealing to a mass market. (The
best-selling American beers are brewed using 30 to 40 percent rice or corn
³adjunct,² resulting in a paler, lighter-bodied and lighter-flavored beer).

--
James Leo Ryan ..... Austin, Texas ..... taliesinsoft.DeleteThis@me.com

On 2008-12-21 19:01:28 -0800, Nick Naym
<nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> said:

>> "Or corn". I can go with corn. At least in my limited perspective there
>> was no rice. It'll take your word for it, since I don't brew the
>> stuff, but I'd prefer a link to the actual named contents.
>
> This (rice) Bud's for you:
> http://www.anheuser-busch.com/mediakits/07_Budweiser_Ingredients.pdf
>
>
> Other (random) Google results:
>
> http://www.2basnob.com/lagers.html
>
> https://www.freebase.com/search?limit=30&start=0&query=american+lager
>
> http://www.brewery.org/library/StylesTD.html
>
> http://www.socialphilly.com/beerfact8.htm
>
> http://www.briansbelly.com/beerbelly/cartablanca.shtml
>
> http://www.brewhog.com/lager.htm
>
> http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/American-lager

Okay. I sauteed my crow in a sage butter sauce and with some very fresh
French bread I found it not only tolerable, but almost tasty.
--
Thank you and have a nice day.

In article <0001HW.C5750DC100173F20B01AD9AF.RemoveThis@News.Individual.NET>,
TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft.RemoveThis@me.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 03:43:23 -0600, Jolly Roger wrote (in article
> <jollyroger-D7ED2E.03432222122008.RemoveThis@news.individual.net>):
>
> [in response to the following assertion]
>
> >> Au contraire. Most American beer -- at least from the major breweries,
> >> including Anheuser-Busch -- are made with 30-40% rice or corn instead of
> >> the 100% malted barley/wheat/rye grains used by most of the "craft"
> >> microbreweries.
> >
> > Citation please?
>
> I found the following at
> <http://supportyourlocalbrewery.com/CraftBeerFactSheet_9_06.pdf>.
>
> Craft Beers: Generally, 3all-malt,2 domestic beers produced using 100 percent
> malted barley by small brewers. Craft beers that are not all-malt sometimes
> substitute a percentage of malted wheat (for wheat beers) or malted rye (for
> rye beers) or other fermentable ingredients intended to enhance flavor. Their
> inspiration can be traced to British, German or Belgian traditions or is
> often uniquely American. Craft beers range from pale to dark in color and
> from mild to strong in alcohol content. Sometimes they include unusual
> ingredients such as fruit, herbs or spices. Compared with other beers, their
> emphasis is more on flavor, and less on appealing to a mass market. (The
> best-selling American beers are brewed using 30 to 40 percent rice or corn
> 3adjunct,2 resulting in a paler, lighter-bodied and lighter-flavored beer).

Actually, right after I posted that, I found the Wikipedia page on
Budweiser, where it states "Budweiser is made with a proportion of rice
in addition to barley malt, for which it has received some criticism,
though the company takes the position that the rice gives the beer a
lighter taste":

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budweiser_(Anheuser-Busch)>

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
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JR

In article <494f0518$0$90267$14726298@news.sunsite.dk>,
AV3 <arvimide.RemoveThis@earthlink.net> wrote:

> České Budeýjovice, called Budweis in German during its time in the
> Austro-Hungarian Empire, was known for its beer. Anheuser-Busch used
> that name with a favorable reputation among the German immigrant
> community in Missouri, without any pretence of imitating the actual
> brewing procedures back home. They took out an international copyright
> on the name, but there is a provision for local names in their own
> countries, so Czech Budweiser beer could still use its traditional name
> but only in Czechoslovakia. When Czechoslovakia went capitalist in 1989,
> Anheuser-Busch tried to buy the brewery in České Budeýjovice for its
> name, but they wouldn't sell.

I am reminded of a time long ago in Bochum when a native friend was
drinking beer carrying that name and I couldn't believe a German would
drink American beer. He assured me it was Czech Budweiser and no
relation So it was possible to get it in Germany back then, but
this was before 1989, though I don't remember the exact year.

--
Mary Loomer Oliver (aka Erilar)

You can't reason with someone whose first line of argument is
that reason doesn't count. --Isaac Asimov

Erilar's Cave Annex: http://www.chibardun.net/~erilarlo 

In article jollyroger-D7ED2E.03432222122008.TakeThisOut@news.individual.net, Jolly Roger
at jollyroger.TakeThisOut@pobox.com wrote on 12/22/08 4:43 AM:

> In article <C5744282.21CFD%nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com>,
> Nick Naym <nicknaym@[remove_this].gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> In article 2008122109510516807-xxx@yyyzzz, gtr at xxx.TakeThisOut@yyy.zzz wrote on
>> 12/21/08 12:51 PM:
>>
>>> On 2008-12-20 11:49:17 -0800, Fred Moore <fmoore.TakeThisOut@gcfn.org> said:
>>>
>>> I
>>> don't believe, lame as it is, that Bud is made with rice. I toured the
>>> production faciliy of Coors at Golden, and there was no rice in the
>>> process. And for the most part they are the same beer as far as I'm
>>> concerned.
>>
>> Au contraire. Most American beer -- at least from the major breweries,
>> including Anheuser-Busch -- are made with 30-40% rice or corn instead of the
>> 100% malted barley/wheat/rye grains used by most of the "craft"
>> microbreweries.
>
> Citation please?


You missed yet another one of my posts? Here:

This (rice) Bud's for you:
http://www.anheuser-busch.com/mediakits/07_Budweiser_Ingredients.pdf


Other (random) Google results:

http://www.2basnob.com/lagers.html

https://www.freebase.com/search?limit=30&start=0&query=american+lager

http://www.brewery.org/library/StylesTD.html

http://www.socialphilly.com/beerfact8.htm

http://www.briansbelly.com/beerbelly/cartablanca.shtml

http://www.brewhog.com/lager.htm

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/American-lager


--
iMac (24", 2.8 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, 320 GB HDD) € OS X (10.5.4)

In article <drache-C2D70D.10544922122008 DeleteThis @news.airstreamcomm.net>,
erilar <drache DeleteThis @chibardun.net.invalid> wrote:

> In article <494f0518$0$90267$14726298@news.sunsite.dk>,
> AV3 <arvimide DeleteThis @earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > České Budeýjovice, called Budweis in German during its time in the
> > Austro-Hungarian Empire, was known for its beer. Anheuser-Busch used
> > that name with a favorable reputation among the German immigrant
> > community in Missouri, without any pretence of imitating the actual
> > brewing procedures back home. They took out an international copyright
> > on the name, but there is a provision for local names in their own
> > countries, so Czech Budweiser beer could still use its traditional name
> > but only in Czechoslovakia. When Czechoslovakia went capitalist in 1989,
> > Anheuser-Busch tried to buy the brewery in České Budeýjovice for its
> > name, but they wouldn't sell.
>
> I am reminded of a time long ago in Bochum when a native friend was
> drinking beer carrying that name and I couldn't believe a German would
> drink American beer. He assured me it was Czech Budweiser and no
> relation So it was possible to get it in Germany back then, but
> this was before 1989, though I don't remember the exact year.

I enjoyed a *lot* of BudWeis in the U.K. in 1995 although it was not
universally available. Of course, I also enjoyed a *lot* of the local
brews as well. Those were the days . . .

Cheers!

Mudge

--
"And if California slides into the ocean like the mystics and
statistics say it will, I predict this motel will be standing
until I pay my bill."

On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:45:23 -0600, gtr wrote (in article
<2008122213452316807-xxx@yyyzzz>):

> As a general (and undoubtedly unfair) description of American tastes; we
> look for volume over quality. Very generally we drink beer to get a buzz,
> not for the flavor.

I guess I fall into the "exception" group in that I drink beer for the
enjoyment of flavor and not to get buzzed. Enjoyment to me is a pint or two
of a good, usually darkish in color, draught.

As an aside, if getting buzzed is the desire than perhaps one should
concentrate on those "high gravity" beers that typically have about threefold
the alcohol content for about two thirds the price of so-called "normal"
beers.

--
James Leo Ryan ..... Austin, Texas ..... taliesinsoft RemoveThis @me.com

On 2008-12-22 14:22:11 -0800, TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft.TakeThisOut@me.com> said:

> On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:45:23 -0600, gtr wrote (in article
> <2008122213452316807-xxx@yyyzzz>):
>
>> As a general (and undoubtedly unfair) description of American tastes; we
>> look for volume over quality. Very generally we drink beer to get a buzz,
>> not for the flavor.
>
> I guess I fall into the "exception" group in that I drink beer for the
> enjoyment of flavor and not to get buzzed. Enjoyment to me is a pint or two
> of a good, usually darkish in color, draught.

I am too, in a way. Sorta. I mean, I like the taste of good beers, a
taste developed over the last 8 years or so. But if I were to get zero
buzz, if it just happened to be a non-alcholic beverage, I wouldn't be
interested. It's not the booze alone, but it is certainly a key
component of my interest.

> As an aside, if getting buzzed is the desire than perhaps one should
> concentrate on those "high gravity" beers that typically have about threefold
> the alcohol content for about two thirds the price of so-called "normal"
> beers.

But these don't have as "absent" a taste. Buzz-only folk don't want to
deal with a more acrid or more demanding taste, thicker texture, etc.
I'm a real gin aficionado from study over the past 2 years or so. I
proselytize among my friends. Some won't' turn at all. They are
*vodka* drinkers. They say they don't like the "taste" of gin, but I
think they don't like *taste*. They want a tasteless buzz operator.
Fruit juice or other simple sweet tastes that aren't muddied by
complexity will do fine. Then put a buzz operator in it that doesn't
change the taste profile; they're happy.

I don't mean this as a put-down or anything. This is just where they
are at. They also simply happen to prefer speghetti at a marinara
house or a pork chop and baked potato to "fussy" (their word) food in
the culinary traditions of France or India. When they encounter a food
or beverage for the first time, "curiousity" is not their first
impluse, caution and suspicious disapproval reign.
--
Thank you and have a nice day.

In article <0001HW.C5756F3300064E56B01AD9AF.TakeThisOut@News.Individual.NET>,
TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft.TakeThisOut@me.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:45:23 -0600, gtr wrote (in article
> <2008122213452316807-xxx@yyyzzz>):
>
> > As a general (and undoubtedly unfair) description of American tastes; we
> > look for volume over quality. Very generally we drink beer to get a buzz,
> > not for the flavor.
>
> I guess I fall into the "exception" group in that I drink beer for the
> enjoyment of flavor and not to get buzzed. Enjoyment to me is a pint or two
> of a good, usually darkish in color, draught.
>
> As an aside, if getting buzzed is the desire than perhaps one should
> concentrate on those "high gravity" beers that typically have about threefold
> the alcohol content for about two thirds the price of so-called "normal"
> beers.

Why stop there? Thunderbird is dirt cheap and will get you buzzed faster
than beer, right?

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

In article <0001HW.C5756F3300064E56B01AD9AF DeleteThis @News.Individual.NET>,
TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft DeleteThis @me.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:45:23 -0600, gtr wrote (in article
> <2008122213452316807-xxx@yyyzzz>):
>
> > As a general (and undoubtedly unfair) description of American tastes; we
> > look for volume over quality. Very generally we drink beer to get a buzz,
> > not for the flavor.
>
> I guess I fall into the "exception" group in that I drink beer for the
> enjoyment of flavor and not to get buzzed. Enjoyment to me is a pint or two
> of a good, usually darkish in color, draught.

As a young, dumb teenager and adult, my single objective in drinking
beer was to get buzzed and drunk, and Budweiser did the job just fine.
Now-a-days, I'm looking for the best *tasting* beer I can find. Since
starting this sub-thread, I've tried and rated these:

Sam Adams (bottled) = ***
Shiner Bock (tap) = ****
Guiness Extra Stout (bottled) = ****

Guiness is my favorite so far - it's delicious. I'd like to try some
others from that region.

I'll be visiting Germany next spring, and will probably try a few German
beers while I'm there. I'm betting I'll find some new favorites there.

--
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:22:00 -0600, Jolly Roger wrote
(in article <jollyroger-58A95D.17220022122008 DeleteThis @news.individual.net>):

> Now-a-days, I'm looking for the best *tasting* beer I can find.

There is a small brewery here in Austin, Live Oak,
<http://www.liveoakbrewing.com/beer/>, which produces a number of quite good
tasting beers. They are only available in some pubs as draughts as they are
only delivered in kegs and not bottles.

Another brewery that produces beers I like is Sierra Nevada
<http://www.sierranevada.com/>. Their Celebration Ale, available only during
the Christmas season is one of my favorites.

And, as I mentioned elsewhere in this thread, there is no better place in my
opinion to enjoy beer than B. B. Rovers <http://www.bbrovers.com/> in
northwest Austin.

--
James Leo Ryan ..... Austin, Texas ..... taliesinsoft DeleteThis @me.com