|
Next: video problem with bootx on 7200
|
| Author |
Message |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 1:20 pm
Post subject: report install on a p510 Archived from groups: linux>debian>ports>powerpc (more info?)
|
|
|
Hi,
I hope these informations will be of some use...
I've downloaded the CD netinstall for powerpc. Everything worked well
except for the reboot.
The kernel installed seems to be a 32 bits one.
Reboot with the install CD + chroot to /target + apt-get install
linux-image-2.6-powerpc64 + ybin solved the problem.
xavier
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-REQUEST.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:20 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 01:12:18PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I hope these informations will be of some use...
> I've downloaded the CD netinstall for powerpc. Everything worked well
> except for the reboot.
Mmm. Ideally, saving the installation logs would have been good, if you can
redo the install, this would be perfect.
> The kernel installed seems to be a 32 bits one.
Can you give us the output of :
dpkg -l | grep linux-image
As well as the content of /boot ?
> Reboot with the install CD + chroot to /target + apt-get install
> linux-image-2.6-powerpc64 + ybin solved the problem.
This should not be the case, i suggest you file a formal installation report
against the base-installer package.
Friendly,
Sven Luther
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-REQUEST.RemoveThis@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.RemoveThis@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 3) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:30 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: linux>debian>maint>boot, others (more info?)
|
|
|
And replied to debian-boot, let's see if this time it is not ignored like it
was so many times in the past.
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 02:16:09PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 01:12:18PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I hope these informations will be of some use...
> > I've downloaded the CD netinstall for powerpc. Everything worked well
> > except for the reboot.
>
> Mmm. Ideally, saving the installation logs would have been good, if you can
> redo the install, this would be perfect.
>
> > The kernel installed seems to be a 32 bits one.
>
> Can you give us the output of :
>
> dpkg -l | grep linux-image
>
> As well as the content of /boot ?
>
> > Reboot with the install CD + chroot to /target + apt-get install
> > linux-image-2.6-powerpc64 + ybin solved the problem.
>
> This should not be the case, i suggest you file a formal installation report
> against the base-installer package.
>
> Friendly,
>
> Sven Luther
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-REQUEST.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Orange vous informe que cet e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus mail.
> Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte.
>
>
>
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 4) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 3:30 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: linux>debian>ports>powerpc (more info?)
|
|
|
Le mardi 05 septembre 2006 à 14:16 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
> On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 01:12:18PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I hope these informations will be of some use...
> > I've downloaded the CD netinstall for powerpc. Everything worked well
> > except for the reboot.
>
> Mmm. Ideally, saving the installation logs would have been good, if you can
> redo the install, this would be perfect.
Sorry we are in a hurry to have the machine running... So perhaps we have the logs somewhere, can you give me the place where I should find them please ?
> > The kernel installed seems to be a 32 bits one.
>
> Can you give us the output of :
>
> dpkg -l | grep linux-image
Too late, I have already clean the /boot to only left remaining the linux-2.6-powerpc64 one.
> As well as the content of /boot ?
As I remember I have seen installation of two kernel : linux-image-2.6 and linux-image-2.6.16-2-powerpc-smp (from memory...)
> > Reboot with the install CD + chroot to /target + apt-get install
> > linux-image-2.6-powerpc64 + ybin solved the problem.
>
> This should not be the case, i suggest you file a formal installation report
> against the base-installer package.
Can you remember me where I should fill it ?
Sorry to only give a such bad report...
xavier
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-REQUEST RemoveThis @lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster RemoveThis @lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 5) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 4:10 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: linux>debian>maint>boot, others (more info?)
|
|
|
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 03:29:44PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> Le mardi 05 septembre 2006 à 14:16 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
> > On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 01:12:18PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I hope these informations will be of some use...
> > > I've downloaded the CD netinstall for powerpc. Everything worked well
> > > except for the reboot.
> >
> > Mmm. Ideally, saving the installation logs would have been good, if you can
> > redo the install, this would be perfect.
> Sorry we are in a hurry to have the machine running... So perhaps we have the logs somewhere, can you give me the place where I should find them please ?
in /var/log, but i suppose they get erased after the install, not sure, look
at your /root dir maybe.
> > > The kernel installed seems to be a 32 bits one.
> >
> > Can you give us the output of :
> >
> > dpkg -l | grep linux-image
> Too late, I have already clean the /boot to only left remaining the linux-2.6-powerpc64 one.
Ok. but did you just rm the files, or also the packages.
> > As well as the content of /boot ?
> As I remember I have seen installation of two kernel : linux-image-2.6 and linux-image-2.6.16-2-powerpc-smp (from memory...)
I would believe there is a bug in the SMP detection, as the powerpc64 kernel
flavour is -smp, and this has been the case since 2.6.15.
I have the feeling that it searches for a powerpc64-smp, and not finding it,
it falls back to the powerpc-smp, but i don't know why, i thought i fixed the
this long ago, and naturally now i cannot do it easily anymore.
> > > Reboot with the install CD + chroot to /target + apt-get install
> > > linux-image-2.6-powerpc64 + ybin solved the problem.
> >
> > This should not be the case, i suggest you file a formal installation report
> > against the base-installer package.
> Can you remember me where I should fill it ?
# apt-get install reportbug
$ reportbug base-installer
follow instructions.
Another thing to do is to file an installation report, and use :
http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/en.i386/ch05s03.html#submit-bug
> Sorry to only give a such bad report...
No problem, it is just that some important d-i folk have decided to exlude me,
and thus have me killfilled, and since they don't read debian-powerpc, any
mail i forward as i used to do just gets lost.
Friendly,
Sven Luther
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST DeleteThis @lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster DeleteThis @lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 6) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 6:40 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 06:04:38PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> I have restarted an install. I will save the log before reboot, install
> the linux-powerpc64 image and don't delete the comptent of /boot...
> Hope it will be enought...
There is a nice 'save logs' item on the menu, which starts a mini ftp server
or something, and offers the logs for download.
Did you file the bug report ? I think filling it correctly to the debian BTS
is the more important thing to do here.
Friendly,
Sven Luther
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST DeleteThis @lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster DeleteThis @lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 7) Posted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:20 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
I have restarted an install. I will save the log before reboot, install
the linux-powerpc64 image and don't delete the comptent of /boot...
Hope it will be enought...
Le mardi 05 septembre 2006 à 16:05 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
> On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 03:29:44PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> > Le mardi 05 septembre 2006 à 14:16 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
> > > On Tue, Sep 05, 2006 at 01:12:18PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > > I hope these informations will be of some use...
> > > > I've downloaded the CD netinstall for powerpc. Everything worked well
> > > > except for the reboot.
> > >
> > > Mmm. Ideally, saving the installation logs would have been good, if you can
> > > redo the install, this would be perfect.
> > Sorry we are in a hurry to have the machine running... So perhaps we have the logs somewhere, can you give me the place where I should find them please ?
>
> in /var/log, but i suppose they get erased after the install, not sure, look
> at your /root dir maybe.
>
> > > > The kernel installed seems to be a 32 bits one.
> > >
> > > Can you give us the output of :
> > >
> > > dpkg -l | grep linux-image
> > Too late, I have already clean the /boot to only left remaining the linux-2.6-powerpc64 one.
>
> Ok. but did you just rm the files, or also the packages.
>
> > > As well as the content of /boot ?
> > As I remember I have seen installation of two kernel : linux-image-2.6 and linux-image-2.6.16-2-powerpc-smp (from memory...)
>
> I would believe there is a bug in the SMP detection, as the powerpc64 kernel
> flavour is -smp, and this has been the case since 2.6.15.
>
> I have the feeling that it searches for a powerpc64-smp, and not finding it,
> it falls back to the powerpc-smp, but i don't know why, i thought i fixed the
> this long ago, and naturally now i cannot do it easily anymore.
>
> > > > Reboot with the install CD + chroot to /target + apt-get install
> > > > linux-image-2.6-powerpc64 + ybin solved the problem.
> > >
> > > This should not be the case, i suggest you file a formal installation report
> > > against the base-installer package.
> > Can you remember me where I should fill it ?
>
> # apt-get install reportbug
>
> $ reportbug base-installer
>
> follow instructions.
>
> Another thing to do is to file an installation report, and use :
>
> http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/en.i386/ch05s03.html#submit-bug
>
> > Sorry to only give a such bad report...
>
> No problem, it is just that some important d-i folk have decided to exlude me,
> and thus have me killfilled, and since they don't read debian-powerpc, any
> mail i forward as i used to do just gets lost.
>
> Friendly,
>
> Sven Luther
>
>
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.RemoveThis@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.RemoveThis@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:00 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
> Did you file the bug report ? I think filling it correctly to the debian BTS
> is the more important thing to do here.
OK the new install is done, report bug filed with logs in it. I hope it
will help.
I'm waiting for the confirmation email.
I still have a problem : no console out of ttyS0.
When I uncomment the line for T0:23:respawn:/sbin/getty -L ttyS0 9600
vt100
in inittab I don't have a console login. In order to work with the
kernel I have to install ssh server.
Does somebody what I need to change ? (I didn't found my answer in
google...)
thanks in advance, xavier
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.DeleteThis@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.DeleteThis@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 9) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 1:30 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 10:58:10AM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
>
> > Did you file the bug report ? I think filling it correctly to the debian BTS
> > is the more important thing to do here.
> OK the new install is done, report bug filed with logs in it. I hope it
> will help.
Thanks.
> I'm waiting for the confirmation email.
>
> I still have a problem : no console out of ttyS0.
your console is either /dev/hvc0 or /dev/hvsi0 depending on wheter you ran a
virtualized environment or not.
> When I uncomment the line for T0:23:respawn:/sbin/getty -L ttyS0 9600
> vt100
> in inittab I don't have a console login. In order to work with the
> kernel I have to install ssh server.
> Does somebody what I need to change ? (I didn't found my answer in
> google...)
See above.
Could you also post your /proc/cpuinfo please ?
Friendly,
Sven Luther
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 10) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 2:50 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 02:13:22PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> Le mercredi 06 septembre 2006 à 13:17 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
> > On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 10:58:10AM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> > >
> > > > Did you file the bug report ? I think filling it correctly to the debian BTS
> > > > is the more important thing to do here.
> > > OK the new install is done, report bug filed with logs in it. I hope it
> > > will help.
> >
> > Thanks.
> You are welcome.
> > > I'm waiting for the confirmation email.
> > >
> > > I still have a problem : no console out of ttyS0.
> >
> > your console is either /dev/hvc0 or /dev/hvsi0 depending on wheter you ran a
> > virtualized environment or not.
> no virtualization at all. I also have a openpower 710 and the /dev/hvc0 didn't worked...
Ah, /dev/hvc0 is what is used for the virtualized environment. i guess yours
is hvsi0, but look at the dmesg output to be sure, and please report back
about it.
> What exactly do I need to put in inittab please ?
Just replace the ttyS0 by a hvsi0, if that is what you use.
> > Could you also post your /proc/cpuinfo please ?
> p5-server-tdm:~/debs_importants# cat /proc/cpuinfo
> processor : 0
> cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
> clock : 1898.100000MHz
> revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
>
> processor : 1
> cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
> clock : 1898.100000MHz
> revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
>
> processor : 2
> cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
> clock : 1898.100000MHz
> revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
>
> processor : 3
> cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
> clock : 1898.100000MHz
> revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
>
> timebase : 237332000
> machine : CHRP IBM,9110-51A
The b-i/k code does :
CPU=`grep '^cpu[[:space:]]*:' "$CPUINFO" | head -n1 | cut -d: -f2 | sed 's/^ *//; s/[, ].*//' | tr A-Z a-z`
case "$CPU" in power3|i-star|s-star|power4|power4+|ppc970*|power5) family=powerpc64 ;;
esac
case "$SUBARCH" in
powermac*|prep|chrp*) echo "$family" ;;
esac
Which should in your case give powerpc64 for family, but i wonder where
$SUBARCH is taken from.
It then does :
CPUS="$(grep -ci ^processor "$CPUINFO")" || CPUS=1
if [ "$CPUS" ] && [ "$CPUS" -gt 1 ] && [ "$1" != "powerpc64" ]; then
SMP=-smp
else
SMP=
fi
Which should yield an empty SMP variable, and thus :
if [ "$SMP" ]; then
echo "linux-image-$KERNEL_MAJOR-$1$SMP"
fi
echo "linux-image-$KERNEL_MAJOR-$1"
;;
Should yield linux-image-2.6-powerpc64.
Let's try this out by hand :
$ grep '^cpu[[:space:]]*:' 710 | head -n1 | cut -d: -f2 | sed 's/^ *//; s/[, ].*//' | tr A-Z a-z
power5+
Ahah, base-installer doesn't know about the power5+, only the power5, it thus
returns powerpc as base flavour, and then everything else is logical.
Sending a patch for this, once i get the return number of your bug report.
Friendly,
Sven Luther
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.DeleteThis@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.DeleteThis@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 11) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 2:50 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
Le mercredi 06 septembre 2006 à 13:17 +0200, Sven Luther a écrit :
> On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 10:58:10AM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
> >
> > > Did you file the bug report ? I think filling it correctly to the debian BTS
> > > is the more important thing to do here.
> > OK the new install is done, report bug filed with logs in it. I hope it
> > will help.
>
> Thanks.
You are welcome.
> > I'm waiting for the confirmation email.
> >
> > I still have a problem : no console out of ttyS0.
>
> your console is either /dev/hvc0 or /dev/hvsi0 depending on wheter you ran a
> virtualized environment or not.
no virtualization at all. I also have a openpower 710 and the /dev/hvc0 didn't worked...
What exactly do I need to put in inittab please ?
> Could you also post your /proc/cpuinfo please ?
p5-server-tdm:~/debs_importants# cat /proc/cpuinfo
processor : 0
cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
clock : 1898.100000MHz
revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
processor : 1
cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
clock : 1898.100000MHz
revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
processor : 2
cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
clock : 1898.100000MHz
revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
processor : 3
cpu : POWER5+ (gs)
clock : 1898.100000MHz
revision : 2.0 (pvr 003b 0200)
timebase : 237332000
machine : CHRP IBM,9110-51A
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Jan 26, 2004 Posts: 245
|
(Msg. 12) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:00 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 02:29:12PM +0200, Xavier Grave wrote:
>
> > >
> > > I still have a problem : no console out of ttyS0.
> >
> > your console is either /dev/hvc0 or /dev/hvsi0 depending on wheter you ran a
> > virtualized environment or not.
> I have tryed :
> hvc0:12345:respawn:/sbin/getty -L 9600 hvc0
> I get this following message :
> hvc_console tty open failed no vty associeted with tty
Try :
T0:23:respawn:/sbin/getty -L hvsi0 9600 vt100
Actually, you can file an finish-install bug report about this issue.
Friendly,
Sven Luther
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST DeleteThis @lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster DeleteThis @lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 13) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:20 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
> >
> > I still have a problem : no console out of ttyS0.
>
> your console is either /dev/hvc0 or /dev/hvsi0 depending on wheter you ran a
> virtualized environment or not.
I have tryed :
hvc0:12345:respawn:/sbin/getty -L 9600 hvc0
I get this following message :
hvc_console tty open failed no vty associeted with tty
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.DeleteThis@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.DeleteThis@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Sep 30, 2005 Posts: 11
|
(Msg. 14) Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:00 pm
Post subject: Re: report install on a p510 [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
386243 is the number of the bug...
for the serial output the line :
T0:23:respawn:/sbin/getty -L hvsi0 9600 vt100
now this is OK, thanks a lot ! I will try it on my openpower710 !
--
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-boot-REQUEST.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster.TakeThisOut@lists.debian.org |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
| Related Topics: | Install on OldWorld - So where are we? What about the miboot floppy images? Did we progress? I have several OldWorld waiting to be freed here. :-) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-REQUEST@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Cont...
BeigeG3 install Problems - I have been running Linux for quite some time this release of Debian testing is giving me a headache. I keep getting Kernel panic tried to kill init and unable to open a console error when booting the kernel with BootX with both the 2.6 and the 2.4..
Can't Install on new PowerBooks - NO IDE - Has anyone tried to install debian on the new PowerBooks yet? I tried and the kernel didn't detect any IDE controller, so I couldn't get the installer going past the select CDROM prompt. I tried loading ide-cd , ide-generic and all other ide module...
new install of lenny on iBook2 - I have a 700mhz ibook with a damaged logic board. So I figured I'd make a Debian media server out of it. Rip music, play albums, etc. Did the install by shining a flashlight at the screen. That was loads of fun (-: Hold the flashlight perpendicular to...
install fails on blade js21 - Dear list, I am trying to install debian on a Blade js21. The installer boots with 4.0r4, but it hangs when it comes to installing the kernel. I downloaded the latest available installer, but it does not even boots (kernel panic). It complains that th... |
|
You can post new topics in this forum You can reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
|
|