Nintendo Wii Tops Black Friday Sales On eBay

On Dec 3, 2:37 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
> "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in messagenews:db7f705b-c408-4253-b673-0c47af73f23b@v42g2000yqv.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 3, 11:26 am, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > messagenews:a9990c10-6264-41eb-847d-f75254338cd1@x8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 2, 9:51 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > messagenews:2f4c4d29-6071-4559-ae99-68acac6f03d1@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Dec 2, 1:47 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > messagenews:1c489349-7adb-43af-b667-c8fd42c325d3@v15g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > > > On Dec 1, 6:31 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > > "Doug Jacobs" <djac....DeleteThis@rawbw.com> wrote in message
>
> > > > >news:yuKdnYKCn7Vk8KnUnZ2dnUVZ_tXinZ2d@posted.rawbandwidth...
>
> > > > > > In alt.games.video.xbox DC <nob....DeleteThis@pseudo.borked.net> wrote:
> > > > > >> According to eBay?s estimate, Sony?s PS3 was also in great
> > > > > >> demand...
> > > > > >> ==========
> > > > > >> Xbox?
>
> > > > > > The only reason the PS3 would appear to be in great demand on eBay
> > > > > > would
> > > > > > be because the older models (20, 60, old80) are backwards
> > > > > > compatible,
> > > > > > while all models from the 40GB and onwards (including the current
> > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > model) are not. The black friday bundles on PS3 were pretty
> > > > > > pathetic
> > > > > > overall. Walmart's online bundle was, and still is, the best: 80GB
> > > > > > lame
> > > > > > PS3 (doesn't play PS2 games), extra controller, DVD controller,
> > > > > > your
> > > > > > choice of game and blu-ray movie from a list of about 30 titles
> > > > > > all
> > > > > > for
> > > > > > $469. Essentially, that's a free movie and game, about a $50
> > > > > > value.
>
> > > > > > If you really want a PS3 cheap, and don't mind getting another
> > > > > > credit
> > > > > > card,
> > > > > > Sony is running a deal where if you get a Sony credit card (Visa
> > > > > > from
> > > > > > Chase) and buy a PS3 from Sony's online store, you'll get a $150
> > > > > > credit
> > > > > > on
> > > > > > your bill. That means you essentially get a PS3 for about $250.
>
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > It's not broken. It's...advanced.
>
> > > > > Are you serious with that "lame" comment? There is only ONE console
> > > > > that
> > > > > has any type of "lame" bundle and we all know who that is. Take a
> > > > > bias
> > > > > break and read what you type before you hit send.
>
> > > > Lame as in gimped, handicapped, etc. Although I'm sure the innuendo
> > > > was intended...
>
> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > You mean like no online or backwards compatibility "gimped"? Hmm, that
> > > > would be the 360 Arcade which is the main reason that it outsold the
> > > > PS3
> > > > 3
> > > > to 1 because an overwhelming majority of them were the Arcade (as
> > > > stated
> > > > by
> > > > MS).
>
> > > I don't disagree. However, note that the "lame" Xbox 360 bundle is
> > > just 1 of the 3 available models and is actually cheap. With the
> > > Playstation 3, you don't have the choice to get the "non-lame" model
> > > because it's not around anymore... and you pay more for the "lame"
> > > model than you do for any other game console on the market.
>
> > > His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> > > endearing.
>
> > > And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> > > capabilities?
>
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > Unless they changes something, you can't go online without a hard drive,
> > > correct?
>
> > Really? I had always been under the impression that you didn't need a
> > hard drive or memory card to go online. I figured you would need one
> > if you wanted to download any XBLA games but I didn't see why you'd
> > have to have one just to connect to Xbox Live.
>
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > I checked around and you need at least a memory card to go online because
> > you can't without a profile and if you want to play certain games, you
> > have
> > to have a hard drive or multiple memory cards.
>
> Since all Arcade units come with a 256MB memory card and you only need
> 128MB of available space to go online, it does have online
> capabilities and thus can only be branded gimped as far as not being
> able to play original Xbox games.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------
>
> ...or being able to play any Xbox Live game that requires an update or save
> multiple games on the card AND go online.
>
> But yeah, that was my point.

Another interpretation could be that the current batch of Playstation
3 models are gimped because they are missing features that were
included in previous versions of the system. While the Xbox 360 Arcade
isn't the ideal configuration, it's one that suits a majority of
owners (who tend NOT to play online) and has always lacked certain
abilities from day one.

No matter when you bought into the Arcade system, it was always clear
what you were getting. On the other hand, there are certainly many
people who thought they would have Playstation 2 backwards
compatibility because every Playstation 3 unit had that functionality
at one point.

Further, you can buy an Ethernet cable and a larger memory card or a
hard drive in order to fully realize the system's capabilities whereas
you can't do anything to bring back the backwards compatibility.

The lack of a hard drive in the Arcade system hasn't been much of a
complaint for owners because they knew what they were losing with the
cheaper price. The lack of backwards compatibility has been a HUGE
complaint with the Playstation 3, however, namely because it's not
something they're going to advertise.

"The alMIGHTY N" <natlee75.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:41509d33-49f8-4901-b9f9-aa1786d15280@g38g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 3, 2:37 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....TakeThisOut@comcast.net> wrote:
> "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in
> messagenews:db7f705b-c408-4253-b673-0c47af73f23b@v42g2000yqv.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 3, 11:26 am, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....TakeThisOut@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > messagenews:a9990c10-6264-41eb-847d-f75254338cd1@x8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 2, 9:51 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....TakeThisOut@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > messagenews:2f4c4d29-6071-4559-ae99-68acac6f03d1@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Dec 2, 1:47 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....TakeThisOut@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > messagenews:1c489349-7adb-43af-b667-c8fd42c325d3@v15g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > > > On Dec 1, 6:31 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....TakeThisOut@comcast.net>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > "Doug Jacobs" <djac....TakeThisOut@rawbw.com> wrote in message
>
> > > > >news:yuKdnYKCn7Vk8KnUnZ2dnUVZ_tXinZ2d@posted.rawbandwidth...
>
> > > > > > In alt.games.video.xbox DC <nob....TakeThisOut@pseudo.borked.net> wrote:
> > > > > >> According to eBay?s estimate, Sony?s PS3 was also in great
> > > > > >> demand...
> > > > > >> ==========
> > > > > >> Xbox?
>
> > > > > > The only reason the PS3 would appear to be in great demand on
> > > > > > eBay
> > > > > > would
> > > > > > be because the older models (20, 60, old80) are backwards
> > > > > > compatible,
> > > > > > while all models from the 40GB and onwards (including the
> > > > > > current
> > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > model) are not. The black friday bundles on PS3 were pretty
> > > > > > pathetic
> > > > > > overall. Walmart's online bundle was, and still is, the best:
> > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > lame
> > > > > > PS3 (doesn't play PS2 games), extra controller, DVD controller,
> > > > > > your
> > > > > > choice of game and blu-ray movie from a list of about 30 titles
> > > > > > all
> > > > > > for
> > > > > > $469. Essentially, that's a free movie and game, about a $50
> > > > > > value.
>
> > > > > > If you really want a PS3 cheap, and don't mind getting another
> > > > > > credit
> > > > > > card,
> > > > > > Sony is running a deal where if you get a Sony credit card (Visa
> > > > > > from
> > > > > > Chase) and buy a PS3 from Sony's online store, you'll get a $150
> > > > > > credit
> > > > > > on
> > > > > > your bill. That means you essentially get a PS3 for about $250.
>
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > It's not broken. It's...advanced.
>
> > > > > Are you serious with that "lame" comment? There is only ONE
> > > > > console
> > > > > that
> > > > > has any type of "lame" bundle and we all know who that is. Take a
> > > > > bias
> > > > > break and read what you type before you hit send.
>
> > > > Lame as in gimped, handicapped, etc. Although I'm sure the innuendo
> > > > was intended...
>
> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > You mean like no online or backwards compatibility "gimped"? Hmm,
> > > > that
> > > > would be the 360 Arcade which is the main reason that it outsold the
> > > > PS3
> > > > 3
> > > > to 1 because an overwhelming majority of them were the Arcade (as
> > > > stated
> > > > by
> > > > MS).
>
> > > I don't disagree. However, note that the "lame" Xbox 360 bundle is
> > > just 1 of the 3 available models and is actually cheap. With the
> > > Playstation 3, you don't have the choice to get the "non-lame" model
> > > because it's not around anymore... and you pay more for the "lame"
> > > model than you do for any other game console on the market.
>
> > > His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> > > endearing.
>
> > > And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> > > capabilities?
>
> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > Unless they changes something, you can't go online without a hard
> > > drive,
> > > correct?
>
> > Really? I had always been under the impression that you didn't need a
> > hard drive or memory card to go online. I figured you would need one
> > if you wanted to download any XBLA games but I didn't see why you'd
> > have to have one just to connect to Xbox Live.
>
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > I checked around and you need at least a memory card to go online
> > because
> > you can't without a profile and if you want to play certain games, you
> > have
> > to have a hard drive or multiple memory cards.
>
> Since all Arcade units come with a 256MB memory card and you only need
> 128MB of available space to go online, it does have online
> capabilities and thus can only be branded gimped as far as not being
> able to play original Xbox games.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------­------
>
> ...or being able to play any Xbox Live game that requires an update or
> save
> multiple games on the card AND go online.
>
> But yeah, that was my point.

Another interpretation could be that the current batch of Playstation
3 models are gimped because they are missing features that were
included in previous versions of the system. While the Xbox 360 Arcade
isn't the ideal configuration, it's one that suits a majority of
owners (who tend NOT to play online) and has always lacked certain
abilities from day one.

No matter when you bought into the Arcade system, it was always clear
what you were getting. On the other hand, there are certainly many
people who thought they would have Playstation 2 backwards
compatibility because every Playstation 3 unit had that functionality
at one point.

Further, you can buy an Ethernet cable and a larger memory card or a
hard drive in order to fully realize the system's capabilities whereas
you can't do anything to bring back the backwards compatibility.

The lack of a hard drive in the Arcade system hasn't been much of a
complaint for owners because they knew what they were losing with the
cheaper price. The lack of backwards compatibility has been a HUGE
complaint with the Playstation 3, however, namely because it's not
something they're going to advertise.

---------------------------------------------------------------

You do realize that you can purchase a PS2 for cheaper that you can a 60GB
hard drive so if you want to talk about purchasing additional stuff, you
have to acknowledge that it goes beyond the spectrum of our conversation
about "gimped" systems. So while true, you can't purchase anything for your
PS3 to bring back BC, you can spend less money to play PS2 games than you
would have to make an Arcade 360 on par with any other version.

On Dec 3, 9:08 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
> "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in messagenews:41509d33-49f8-4901-b9f9-aa1786d15280@g38g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 3, 2:37 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > messagenews:db7f705b-c408-4253-b673-0c47af73f23b@v42g2000yqv.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 3, 11:26 am, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > messagenews:a9990c10-6264-41eb-847d-f75254338cd1@x8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Dec 2, 9:51 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > messagenews:2f4c4d29-6071-4559-ae99-68acac6f03d1@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> > > > On Dec 2, 1:47 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > > messagenews:1c489349-7adb-43af-b667-c8fd42c325d3@v15g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > > > > On Dec 1, 6:31 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos....DeleteThis@comcast.net>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > "Doug Jacobs" <djac....DeleteThis@rawbw.com> wrote in message
>
> > > > > >news:yuKdnYKCn7Vk8KnUnZ2dnUVZ_tXinZ2d@posted.rawbandwidth...
>
> > > > > > > In alt.games.video.xbox DC <nob....DeleteThis@pseudo.borked.net> wrote:
> > > > > > >> According to eBay?s estimate, Sony?s PS3 was also in great
> > > > > > >> demand...
> > > > > > >> ==========
> > > > > > >> Xbox?
>
> > > > > > > The only reason the PS3 would appear to be in great demand on
> > > > > > > eBay
> > > > > > > would
> > > > > > > be because the older models (20, 60, old80) are backwards
> > > > > > > compatible,
> > > > > > > while all models from the 40GB and onwards (including the
> > > > > > > current
> > > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > > model) are not. The black friday bundles on PS3 were pretty
> > > > > > > pathetic
> > > > > > > overall. Walmart's online bundle was, and still is, the best:
> > > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > > lame
> > > > > > > PS3 (doesn't play PS2 games), extra controller, DVD controller,
> > > > > > > your
> > > > > > > choice of game and blu-ray movie from a list of about 30 titles
> > > > > > > all
> > > > > > > for
> > > > > > > $469. Essentially, that's a free movie and game, about a $50
> > > > > > > value.
>
> > > > > > > If you really want a PS3 cheap, and don't mind getting another
> > > > > > > credit
> > > > > > > card,
> > > > > > > Sony is running a deal where if you get a Sony credit card (Visa
> > > > > > > from
> > > > > > > Chase) and buy a PS3 from Sony's online store, you'll get a $150
> > > > > > > credit
> > > > > > > on
> > > > > > > your bill. That means you essentially get a PS3 for about $250.
>
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > It's not broken. It's...advanced.
>
> > > > > > Are you serious with that "lame" comment? There is only ONE
> > > > > > console
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > has any type of "lame" bundle and we all know who that is. Take a
> > > > > > bias
> > > > > > break and read what you type before you hit send.
>
> > > > > Lame as in gimped, handicapped, etc. Although I'm sure the innuendo
> > > > > was intended...
>
> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > > You mean like no online or backwards compatibility "gimped"? Hmm,
> > > > > that
> > > > > would be the 360 Arcade which is the main reason that it outsold the
> > > > > PS3
> > > > > 3
> > > > > to 1 because an overwhelming majority of them were the Arcade (as
> > > > > stated
> > > > > by
> > > > > MS).
>
> > > > I don't disagree. However, note that the "lame" Xbox 360 bundle is
> > > > just 1 of the 3 available models and is actually cheap. With the
> > > > Playstation 3, you don't have the choice to get the "non-lame" model
> > > > because it's not around anymore... and you pay more for the "lame"
> > > > model than you do for any other game console on the market.
>
> > > > His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> > > > endearing.
>
> > > > And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> > > > capabilities?
>
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > Unless they changes something, you can't go online without a hard
> > > > drive,
> > > > correct?
>
> > > Really? I had always been under the impression that you didn't need a
> > > hard drive or memory card to go online. I figured you would need one
> > > if you wanted to download any XBLA games but I didn't see why you'd
> > > have to have one just to connect to Xbox Live.
>
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > I checked around and you need at least a memory card to go online
> > > because
> > > you can't without a profile and if you want to play certain games, you
> > > have
> > > to have a hard drive or multiple memory cards.
>
> > Since all Arcade units come with a 256MB memory card and you only need
> > 128MB of available space to go online, it does have online
> > capabilities and thus can only be branded gimped as far as not being
> > able to play original Xbox games.
>
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­------
>
> > ...or being able to play any Xbox Live game that requires an update or
> > save
> > multiple games on the card AND go online.
>
> > But yeah, that was my point.
>
> Another interpretation could be that the current batch of Playstation
> 3 models are gimped because they are missing features that were
> included in previous versions of the system. While the Xbox 360 Arcade
> isn't the ideal configuration, it's one that suits a majority of
> owners (who tend NOT to play online) and has always lacked certain
> abilities from day one.
>
> No matter when you bought into the Arcade system, it was always clear
> what you were getting. On the other hand, there are certainly many
> people who thought they would have Playstation 2 backwards
> compatibility because every Playstation 3 unit had that functionality
> at one point.
>
> Further, you can buy an Ethernet cable and a larger memory card or a
> hard drive in order to fully realize the system's capabilities whereas
> you can't do anything to bring back the backwards compatibility.
>
> The lack of a hard drive in the Arcade system hasn't been much of a
> complaint for owners because they knew what they were losing with the
> cheaper price. The lack of backwards compatibility has been a HUGE
> complaint with the Playstation 3, however, namely because it's not
> something they're going to advertise.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> You do realize that you can purchase a PS2 for cheaper that you can a 60GB
> hard drive

Can you? The starter pack that includes the 60GB hard drive, a wired
headset, an ethernet cable and 3 months of Xbox Live Gold membership
has a retail price of $99. A standalone Playstation 2 console costs
$129.99.

I know what you're trying to say but you're comparing apples and
oranges. I purchased a Playstation 2 just so I could play Playstation
2 games but that's purchasing an entire new system that I now have to
wire up and takes up a Wii's amount of physical space. It's another
controller, another set of cables, etc.

I would much prefer not having to have another system.

> so if you want to talk about purchasing additional stuff, you
> have to acknowledge that it goes beyond the spectrum of our conversation
> about "gimped" systems.

I disagree. The fact that you can purchase official Xbox 360
accessories to upgrade the Arcade model's capabilities to match the
Pro model's capabilities and the fact that you cannot do the same for
the Playstation 3 ties directly into the conversation.

> So while true, you can't purchase anything for your
> PS3 to bring back BC, you can spend less money to play PS2 games than you
> would have to make an Arcade 360 on par with any other version.

You have to spend more money as I showed above. The $99.99 starter
pack makes the Arcade model the near equivalent of the Pro model. The
controller will still be wired but you get 3 months of Gold
membership. And you end up spending the same amount of money as if you
purchased a Pro model in the first place.

There is no way to upgrade the Playstation 3s that came out in late
2007 and beyond to have backwards compatibility. The only thing you
can do is go out and buy an actual previous generation console which
is far different from upgrading a system.

In alt.games.video.xbox Mattinglyfan <kylerjainospam.RemoveThis@comcast.net> wrote:
> His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> endearing.

A non-BC PS3 is lame, IMHO, however the current set of bundle deals is
also pretty lame, also IMHO.

> And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> capabilities?

This is kind of complicated...

An Arcade model without a hard drive is technically capable of going online -
even playing games online. However some games, like Burnout Paradise, now
require the hard drive to go online because of the subsequent addons they've
released for the game which won't fit on the Arcade's 256MB storage card.

Furthermore, going online now means you'll have to download the NXE -
which the Arcade can do, but will use up half of your memory card. Also,
you can forget about downloading demos and most XBLA games unless you have
a hard drive.

So...yes, a hard drive-less 360 can play online, but you really should at
least get the 20GB hard drive.

--
It's not broken. It's...advanced.

On Dec 4, 2:43 pm, Doug Jacobs <djac....RemoveThis@rawbw.com> wrote:
> In alt.games.video.xbox Mattinglyfan <kylerjainos....RemoveThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> > endearing.
>
> A non-BC PS3 is lame, IMHO, however the current set of bundle deals is
> also pretty lame, also IMHO.
>
> > And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> > capabilities?
>
> This is kind of complicated...
>
> An Arcade model without a hard drive is technically capable of going online -
> even playing games online.  However some games, like Burnout Paradise, now
> require the hard drive to go online because of the subsequent addons they've
> released for the game which won't fit on the Arcade's 256MB storage card.

It seems that no Core/Arcade model was capable of going online as
going online has always required some sort of Xbox Live user profile,
which cannot be created unless one has a hard drive or memory card on
which to save that profile.

The Core units never came with even a memory card so they were
incapable of accessing Xbox Live out of the box. The Arcade units
include a 256MB memory card but don't include an ethernet cable so
you're still SOL out of the box.

> Furthermore, going online now means you'll have to download the NXE -
> which the Arcade can do, but will use up half of your memory card.  Also,
> you can forget about downloading demos and most XBLA games unless you have
> a hard drive.

You certainly won't be able to download demos for retail games, but
you should be able to download almost any XBLA game even after you've
grabbed the NXE since most games were developed under the 50MB cap and
only a handful of games have used up more than that.

> So...yes, a hard drive-less 360 can play online, but you really should at
> least get the 20GB hard drive.

The 20GB hard drive is no longer available at retail and you can't
even buy it directly from Amazon.com (you have to go to one of the
affiliates and lose out on free shipping). The smartest option is to
go for the 60GB starter pack that includes the wired headset, an
ethernet cable and 3 months of Xbox Live Gold membership all for $100.

However, then, you might as well get the Pro model since you get a
component cable and a wireless controller in lieu of 3 months of Xbox
Live Gold... unless, of course, you don't care about the shiny DVD
drive, a wireless controller or HD gaming (maybe you don't have an
HDTV).

On Dec 5, 11:09 am, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net> wrote:
> "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in messagenews:9b4fd530-2795-4ab7-ac07-34c6c40401f8@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 3, 9:08 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > messagenews:41509d33-49f8-4901-b9f9-aa1786d15280@g38g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 3, 2:37 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > messagenews:db7f705b-c408-4253-b673-0c47af73f23b@v42g2000yqv.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Dec 3, 11:26 am, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > messagenews:a9990c10-6264-41eb-847d-f75254338cd1@x8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> > > > On Dec 2, 9:51 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > > messagenews:2f4c4d29-6071-4559-ae99-68acac6f03d1@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> > > > > On Dec 2, 1:47 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > > > messagenews:1c489349-7adb-43af-b667-c8fd42c325d3@v15g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > > > > > On Dec 1, 6:31 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... RemoveThis @comcast.net>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > "Doug Jacobs" <djac... RemoveThis @rawbw.com> wrote in message
>
> > > > > > >news:yuKdnYKCn7Vk8KnUnZ2dnUVZ_tXinZ2d@posted.rawbandwidth...
>
> > > > > > > > In alt.games.video.xbox DC <nob... RemoveThis @pseudo.borked.net> wrote:
> > > > > > > >> According to eBay?s estimate, Sony?s PS3 was also in great
> > > > > > > >> demand...
> > > > > > > >> ==========
> > > > > > > >> Xbox?
>
> > > > > > > > The only reason the PS3 would appear to be in great demand on
> > > > > > > > eBay
> > > > > > > > would
> > > > > > > > be because the older models (20, 60, old80) are backwards
> > > > > > > > compatible,
> > > > > > > > while all models from the 40GB and onwards (including the
> > > > > > > > current
> > > > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > > > model) are not. The black friday bundles on PS3 were pretty
> > > > > > > > pathetic
> > > > > > > > overall. Walmart's online bundle was, and still is, the best:
> > > > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > > > lame
> > > > > > > > PS3 (doesn't play PS2 games), extra controller, DVD
> > > > > > > > controller,
> > > > > > > > your
> > > > > > > > choice of game and blu-ray movie from a list of about 30
> > > > > > > > titles
> > > > > > > > all
> > > > > > > > for
> > > > > > > > $469. Essentially, that's a free movie and game, about a $50
> > > > > > > > value.
>
> > > > > > > > If you really want a PS3 cheap, and don't mind getting another
> > > > > > > > credit
> > > > > > > > card,
> > > > > > > > Sony is running a deal where if you get a Sony credit card
> > > > > > > > (Visa
> > > > > > > > from
> > > > > > > > Chase) and buy a PS3 from Sony's online store, you'll get a
> > > > > > > > $150
> > > > > > > > credit
> > > > > > > > on
> > > > > > > > your bill. That means you essentially get a PS3 for about
> > > > > > > > $250.
>
> > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > It's not broken. It's...advanced.
>
> > > > > > > Are you serious with that "lame" comment? There is only ONE
> > > > > > > console
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > has any type of "lame" bundle and we all know who that is. Take
> > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > bias
> > > > > > > break and read what you type before you hit send.
>
> > > > > > Lame as in gimped, handicapped, etc. Although I'm sure the
> > > > > > innuendo
> > > > > > was intended...
>
> > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > > > You mean like no online or backwards compatibility "gimped"? Hmm,
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > would be the 360 Arcade which is the main reason that it outsold
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > PS3
> > > > > > 3
> > > > > > to 1 because an overwhelming majority of them were the Arcade (as
> > > > > > stated
> > > > > > by
> > > > > > MS).
>
> > > > > I don't disagree. However, note that the "lame" Xbox 360 bundle is
> > > > > just 1 of the 3 available models and is actually cheap. With the
> > > > > Playstation 3, you don't have the choice to get the "non-lame" model
> > > > > because it's not around anymore... and you pay more for the "lame"
> > > > > model than you do for any other game console on the market.
>
> > > > > His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> > > > > endearing.
>
> > > > > And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> > > > > capabilities?
>
> > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > > Unless they changes something, you can't go online without a hard
> > > > > drive,
> > > > > correct?
>
> > > > Really? I had always been under the impression that you didn't need a
> > > > hard drive or memory card to go online. I figured you would need one
> > > > if you wanted to download any XBLA games but I didn't see why you'd
> > > > have to have one just to connect to Xbox Live.
>
> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > I checked around and you need at least a memory card to go online
> > > > because
> > > > you can't without a profile and if you want to play certain games, you
> > > > have
> > > > to have a hard drive or multiple memory cards.
>
> > > Since all Arcade units come with a 256MB memory card and you only need
> > > 128MB of available space to go online, it does have online
> > > capabilities and thus can only be branded gimped as far as not being
> > > able to play original Xbox games.
>
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­­------
>
> > > ...or being able to play any Xbox Live game that requires an update or
> > > save
> > > multiple games on the card AND go online.
>
> > > But yeah, that was my point.
>
> > Another interpretation could be that the current batch of Playstation
> > 3 models are gimped because they are missing features that were
> > included in previous versions of the system. While the Xbox 360 Arcade
> > isn't the ideal configuration, it's one that suits a majority of
> > owners (who tend NOT to play online) and has always lacked certain
> > abilities from day one.
>
> > No matter when you bought into the Arcade system, it was always clear
> > what you were getting. On the other hand, there are certainly many
> > people who thought they would have Playstation 2 backwards
> > compatibility because every Playstation 3 unit had that functionality
> > at one point.
>
> > Further, you can buy an Ethernet cable and a larger memory card or a
> > hard drive in order to fully realize the system's capabilities whereas
> > you can't do anything to bring back the backwards compatibility.
>
> > The lack of a hard drive in the Arcade system hasn't been much of a
> > complaint for owners because they knew what they were losing with the
> > cheaper price. The lack of backwards compatibility has been a HUGE
> > complaint with the Playstation 3, however, namely because it's not
> > something they're going to advertise.
>
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > You do realize that you can purchase a PS2 for cheaper that you can a 60GB
> > hard drive
>
> Can you? The starter pack that includes the 60GB hard drive, a wired
> headset, an ethernet cable and 3 months of Xbox Live Gold membership
> has a retail price of $99. A standalone Playstation 2 console costs
> $129.99.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I don't know where you live but over here, the "standalone" PS2 can be had
> for $99.

I live in the United States where the MSRP on the standalone
Playstation 2 is $129.99. This is how much it sells for in every major
retailer from Target to Best Buy. The bundle that includes Lego Batman
and the new Justice League DVD costs $149.99. Neither of these price
points are up for debate.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7266638&st=Playstation+2...pe=prod

http://www.amazon.com/PlayStation-2-Console-Black/dp/B000TLU67W/ref=pd...s_sr_3?

http://www.target.com/PlayStation-2-Console-Satin-Silver/dp/B000TYQL1O...d=12284

http://www.toysrus.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2839080

> Our version that costs $129 comes with Lego Batman and a Justice
> League DVD or Singstar.  But then again, maybe we are one of those markets
> that has not phased out old school black ($99) but that version is on sale
> right now and we have to go to BB, CC or WM to buy the silver.

You should recheck those prices because they are not inline with the
price points offered by every major retailer in this country. If
you're talking about a small independent game shop, then that's
another story and nixes the relevance of your price points.

> Our
> Gamestops sell both but they hide the black and don't promote the lower
> price.

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=36612

http://www.gamestop.com/Catalog/ProductDetails.aspx?product_id=62183

There's no reason for them to promote a price that is $30 lower than
the one everyone else sells it for. You can check every one of them -
Toys R Us, K-Mart, Wal-mart, Target, Best Buy, Circuit City, Game
Stop, EB Games, and so on and so forth. The price is $129.99 for the
standalone Playstation 2 - black or silver - at every one of those
stores.

"The alMIGHTY N" <natlee75 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:9b4fd530-2795-4ab7-ac07-34c6c40401f8@p2g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
On Dec 3, 9:08 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net> wrote:
> "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> messagenews:41509d33-49f8-4901-b9f9-aa1786d15280@g38g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 3, 2:37 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > messagenews:db7f705b-c408-4253-b673-0c47af73f23b@v42g2000yqv.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 3, 11:26 am, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > messagenews:a9990c10-6264-41eb-847d-f75254338cd1@x8g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Dec 2, 9:51 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > messagenews:2f4c4d29-6071-4559-ae99-68acac6f03d1@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> > > > On Dec 2, 1:47 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > "The alMIGHTY N" <natle... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in
> > > > > messagenews:1c489349-7adb-43af-b667-c8fd42c325d3@v15g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
> > > > > On Dec 1, 6:31 pm, "Mattinglyfan" <kylerjainos... DeleteThis @comcast.net>
> > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > "Doug Jacobs" <djac... DeleteThis @rawbw.com> wrote in message
>
> > > > > >news:yuKdnYKCn7Vk8KnUnZ2dnUVZ_tXinZ2d@posted.rawbandwidth...
>
> > > > > > > In alt.games.video.xbox DC <nob... DeleteThis @pseudo.borked.net> wrote:
> > > > > > >> According to eBay?s estimate, Sony?s PS3 was also in great
> > > > > > >> demand...
> > > > > > >> ==========
> > > > > > >> Xbox?
>
> > > > > > > The only reason the PS3 would appear to be in great demand on
> > > > > > > eBay
> > > > > > > would
> > > > > > > be because the older models (20, 60, old80) are backwards
> > > > > > > compatible,
> > > > > > > while all models from the 40GB and onwards (including the
> > > > > > > current
> > > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > > model) are not. The black friday bundles on PS3 were pretty
> > > > > > > pathetic
> > > > > > > overall. Walmart's online bundle was, and still is, the best:
> > > > > > > 80GB
> > > > > > > lame
> > > > > > > PS3 (doesn't play PS2 games), extra controller, DVD
> > > > > > > controller,
> > > > > > > your
> > > > > > > choice of game and blu-ray movie from a list of about 30
> > > > > > > titles
> > > > > > > all
> > > > > > > for
> > > > > > > $469. Essentially, that's a free movie and game, about a $50
> > > > > > > value.
>
> > > > > > > If you really want a PS3 cheap, and don't mind getting another
> > > > > > > credit
> > > > > > > card,
> > > > > > > Sony is running a deal where if you get a Sony credit card
> > > > > > > (Visa
> > > > > > > from
> > > > > > > Chase) and buy a PS3 from Sony's online store, you'll get a
> > > > > > > $150
> > > > > > > credit
> > > > > > > on
> > > > > > > your bill. That means you essentially get a PS3 for about
> > > > > > > $250.
>
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > It's not broken. It's...advanced.
>
> > > > > > Are you serious with that "lame" comment? There is only ONE
> > > > > > console
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > has any type of "lame" bundle and we all know who that is. Take
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > bias
> > > > > > break and read what you type before you hit send.
>
> > > > > Lame as in gimped, handicapped, etc. Although I'm sure the
> > > > > innuendo
> > > > > was intended...
>
> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > > You mean like no online or backwards compatibility "gimped"? Hmm,
> > > > > that
> > > > > would be the 360 Arcade which is the main reason that it outsold
> > > > > the
> > > > > PS3
> > > > > 3
> > > > > to 1 because an overwhelming majority of them were the Arcade (as
> > > > > stated
> > > > > by
> > > > > MS).
>
> > > > I don't disagree. However, note that the "lame" Xbox 360 bundle is
> > > > just 1 of the 3 available models and is actually cheap. With the
> > > > Playstation 3, you don't have the choice to get the "non-lame" model
> > > > because it's not around anymore... and you pay more for the "lame"
> > > > model than you do for any other game console on the market.
>
> > > > His point was that the Black Friday deals just weren't all that
> > > > endearing.
>
> > > > And where did you get the idea that the Arcade model has no online
> > > > capabilities?
>
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > Unless they changes something, you can't go online without a hard
> > > > drive,
> > > > correct?
>
> > > Really? I had always been under the impression that you didn't need a
> > > hard drive or memory card to go online. I figured you would need one
> > > if you wanted to download any XBLA games but I didn't see why you'd
> > > have to have one just to connect to Xbox Live.
>
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > I checked around and you need at least a memory card to go online
> > > because
> > > you can't without a profile and if you want to play certain games, you
> > > have
> > > to have a hard drive or multiple memory cards.
>
> > Since all Arcade units come with a 256MB memory card and you only need
> > 128MB of available space to go online, it does have online
> > capabilities and thus can only be branded gimped as far as not being
> > able to play original Xbox games.
>
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------­­------
>
> > ...or being able to play any Xbox Live game that requires an update or
> > save
> > multiple games on the card AND go online.
>
> > But yeah, that was my point.
>
> Another interpretation could be that the current batch of Playstation
> 3 models are gimped because they are missing features that were
> included in previous versions of the system. While the Xbox 360 Arcade
> isn't the ideal configuration, it's one that suits a majority of
> owners (who tend NOT to play online) and has always lacked certain
> abilities from day one.
>
> No matter when you bought into the Arcade system, it was always clear
> what you were getting. On the other hand, there are certainly many
> people who thought they would have Playstation 2 backwards
> compatibility because every Playstation 3 unit had that functionality
> at one point.
>
> Further, you can buy an Ethernet cable and a larger memory card or a
> hard drive in order to fully realize the system's capabilities whereas
> you can't do anything to bring back the backwards compatibility.
>
> The lack of a hard drive in the Arcade system hasn't been much of a
> complaint for owners because they knew what they were losing with the
> cheaper price. The lack of backwards compatibility has been a HUGE
> complaint with the Playstation 3, however, namely because it's not
> something they're going to advertise.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> You do realize that you can purchase a PS2 for cheaper that you can a 60GB
> hard drive

Can you? The starter pack that includes the 60GB hard drive, a wired
headset, an ethernet cable and 3 months of Xbox Live Gold membership
has a retail price of $99. A standalone Playstation 2 console costs
$129.99.


--------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't know where you live but over here, the "standalone" PS2 can be had
for $99. Our version that costs $129 comes with Lego Batman and a Justice
League DVD or Singstar. But then again, maybe we are one of those markets
that has not phased out old school black ($99) but that version is on sale
right now and we have to go to BB, CC or WM to buy the silver. Our
Gamestops sell both but they hide the black and don't promote the lower
price.

On Dec 8, 4:41 pm, Doug Jacobs <djac....RemoveThis@rawbw.com> wrote:
> In alt.games.video.xbox The alMIGHTY N <natle....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> An Arcade model without a hard drive is technically capable of going online -
> >> even playing games online. ?However some games, like Burnout Paradise, now
> >> require the hard drive to go online because of the subsequent addons they've
> >> released for the game which won't fit on the Arcade's 256MB storage card.
>
> > It seems that no Core/Arcade model was capable of going online as
> > going online has always required some sort of Xbox Live user profile,
> > which cannot be created unless one has a hard drive or memory card on
> > which to save that profile.
>
> > The Core units never came with even a memory card so they were
> > incapable of accessing Xbox Live out of the box. The Arcade units
> > include a 256MB memory card but don't include an ethernet cable so
> > you're still SOL out of the box.
>
> If you're looking at it from the point of view of "stuff in the box", then
> yes, neither the Core or Arcade are capable of playing online out of the
> box.  However that doesn't meant there's something physically different
> about those consoels that makes it impossible for them to go online - with
> the proper accessories.  This is different from the current line up of
> PS3s which cannot play PS2 games, no matter what the consumer buys for
> them.
>
> >> Furthermore, going online now means you'll have to download the NXE -
> >> which the Arcade can do, but will use up half of your memory card. ?Also,
> >> you can forget about downloading demos and most XBLA games unless you have
> >> a hard drive.
>
> > You certainly won't be able to download demos for retail games, but
> > you should be able to download almost any XBLA game even after you've
> > grabbed the NXE since most games were developed under the 50MB cap and
> > only a handful of games have used up more than that.
>
> Even so, with the 256MB memory card, you're going to be really cramped.
>
> >> So...yes, a hard drive-less 360 can play online, but you really should at
> >> least get the 20GB hard drive.
>
> > The 20GB hard drive is no longer available at retail and you can't
> > even buy it directly from Amazon.com (you have to go to one of the
> > affiliates and lose out on free shipping). The smartest option is to
> > go for the 60GB starter pack that includes the wired headset, an
> > ethernet cable and 3 months of Xbox Live Gold membership all for $100.
>
> Microsoft is selling off their remaining stock of 20GB drives directly
> from xbox.com.  You can get one for $30, and it comes with a 3 months Live
> subscription card.

My son's godfather is going to be REALLY pissed that I didn't know
about this earlier. He just purchased a refurbished 20GB hard drive
with a controller for like $80. LOL

> > However, then, you might as well get the Pro model since you get a
> > component cable and a wireless controller in lieu of 3 months of Xbox
> > Live Gold... unless, of course, you don't care about the shiny DVD
> > drive, a wireless controller or HD gaming (maybe you don't have an
> > HDTV).
>
> Yes, my recommendation for anyone buying a new 360 is to buy the Pro
> because the extras that are included make it cheaper than if you bought
> everything separately.  However some people really don't have the extra
> $100 to spend right now, or are just getting an Arcade unit as a gift (as
> I did.)

I was going to buy my nephew an Arcade unit for Christmas but I had
the wrath of all the women in the family chastising me for not
considering that he's lazy and already plays way too many games on the
little portables he has.

In alt.games.video.xbox The alMIGHTY N <natlee75.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> An Arcade model without a hard drive is technically capable of going online -
>> even playing games online. ?However some games, like Burnout Paradise, now
>> require the hard drive to go online because of the subsequent addons they've
>> released for the game which won't fit on the Arcade's 256MB storage card.
>
> It seems that no Core/Arcade model was capable of going online as
> going online has always required some sort of Xbox Live user profile,
> which cannot be created unless one has a hard drive or memory card on
> which to save that profile.
>
> The Core units never came with even a memory card so they were
> incapable of accessing Xbox Live out of the box. The Arcade units
> include a 256MB memory card but don't include an ethernet cable so
> you're still SOL out of the box.

If you're looking at it from the point of view of "stuff in the box", then
yes, neither the Core or Arcade are capable of playing online out of the
box. However that doesn't meant there's something physically different
about those consoels that makes it impossible for them to go online - with
the proper accessories. This is different from the current line up of
PS3s which cannot play PS2 games, no matter what the consumer buys for
them.

>> Furthermore, going online now means you'll have to download the NXE -
>> which the Arcade can do, but will use up half of your memory card. ?Also,
>> you can forget about downloading demos and most XBLA games unless you have
>> a hard drive.
>
> You certainly won't be able to download demos for retail games, but
> you should be able to download almost any XBLA game even after you've
> grabbed the NXE since most games were developed under the 50MB cap and
> only a handful of games have used up more than that.

Even so, with the 256MB memory card, you're going to be really cramped.

>> So...yes, a hard drive-less 360 can play online, but you really should at
>> least get the 20GB hard drive.
>
> The 20GB hard drive is no longer available at retail and you can't
> even buy it directly from Amazon.com (you have to go to one of the
> affiliates and lose out on free shipping). The smartest option is to
> go for the 60GB starter pack that includes the wired headset, an
> ethernet cable and 3 months of Xbox Live Gold membership all for $100.

Microsoft is selling off their remaining stock of 20GB drives directly
from xbox.com. You can get one for $30, and it comes with a 3 months Live
subscription card.

> However, then, you might as well get the Pro model since you get a
> component cable and a wireless controller in lieu of 3 months of Xbox
> Live Gold... unless, of course, you don't care about the shiny DVD
> drive, a wireless controller or HD gaming (maybe you don't have an
> HDTV).

Yes, my recommendation for anyone buying a new 360 is to buy the Pro
because the extras that are included make it cheaper than if you bought
everything separately. However some people really don't have the extra
$100 to spend right now, or are just getting an Arcade unit as a gift (as
I did.)

--
It's not broken. It's...advanced.