How to Make 4th Edition More Interesting?

On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:22:18 +0100, "Vincenzo Beretta"
<reckall RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:

>
>"Kyle Wilson" <kyle RemoveThis @wilson.mv.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
>news:l3mvk4t6fpill0c87s42cm4hn8mrr74ioe@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:58:55 +0100, "Vincenzo Beretta"
>> <reckall RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Cutting 3.5 pages and pasting them into 4E books ^^
>>>
>>
>> A terrible waste of irreplaceable 3.5e core books...
>
>True, but desperation can lead you over dangerous edges...
>
>The only items I bought for 4E wre the new "Forgotten Realms". I mean (I
>thought) you can screw up a ruleset but not a *firmly established setting*
>uhu? Boy, the horror *_*

I preordered the 4e core-rules boxed set, but I haven't been able to
warm up to running games with it. I've played a small amount of
pick-up gaming (one session runs) in 4e and found that it felt more
like a skirmish game than 3.5e does (that can be fun, but it didn't
give me the sort of role-playing goodness that I'm looking for). I
haven't read the forgotten realms book for 4e, but I certainly have
heard enough about what they were aiming for that I'm not interested
in spending money on it.

--

Kyle Wilson
email: kylewilson RemoveThis @wilson.mv.com

This message is not archived

> I just took a look, and it does appear that Amazon is no longer
> directly stocking 3.5e DMG or PHB volumes. Makes me very glad that I
> bought a spare set of DMG/PHB/MM while they were still directly
> available. Currently, the 4e PHB is $23.07 while the 3.5e PHB is
> $36.99. Looks like the 3.5e books are still in demand...

When 4E was revealed in all its ghastly truth I started a buying spree of
3.5 stuff (the strong value of the Euro vs. the Dollar helped). This was
around last summer. I now can get the items I miss in .PDF format (even if I
already have everything I wanted to possess in book form).

The lucky thing is that 3.5's stuff can give me at least another 5 years of
adventures (yes, it was *that* dense). This, and the fact that I usually do
write my own plots, helps a lot. However, I naively thought that the quality
of the narrative stuff for 4E would at least be comparable with 3E - and a
source of inspiration to be retrofitted to my 3.5 campaign. After reading
the two (two? and why so??) horrifying books about the "new and improved"
Forgotten Realms, I instead think that the Spellplague will somehow avoid my
lands.

> I had no idea of the changes to the Realms, having decided
> 4ed wasn't for me well before the changes your talking about
> were public.
>
> My rude awakening came when I picked up a novel set in the
> Realms.
>
> I guess I won't be buying any of their fiction anymore, either.

When I read the part about the "World of Abeir" I knew that the writing was
on the wall.

"Abeir-Toril" meant "The Cradle of Life", and that's was it. Pulling a whole
planet out of the a** while doing no good to the original one is not my idea
of "evolution" (and using children letter cubes as printing blocks so to
cram - uhm - half of the info in twice the space didn't made things better).

Maybe "It is easier! It is fun!" Dunno. For sure, the whole new approach "Is
moronic!". And running the "old" FR is both easy and fun without the need to
assume that IQ 35 is the new gamers' standard.

They say that "the poet is someone able to put in words things that you
already felt in your heart". For sure "Worlds in a Handful of Dice"'s review
of the new FR literally stole the words from my mouth.
http://nitessine.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/a-rant-and-a-review-forgotte...ealms-c

Actually I'm a little bit ashamed, since I wanted to write my own review of
this fiasco, but this one was better, clearer and more concise than anything
I could come up with - so, there you go.

Vincenzo Beretta wrote:

>>I had no idea of the changes to the Realms, having decided
>>4ed wasn't for me well before the changes your talking about
>>were public.
>>
>>My rude awakening came when I picked up a novel set in the
>>Realms.
>>
>>I guess I won't be buying any of their fiction anymore, either.
>
>
> When I read the part about the "World of Abeir" I knew that the writing was
> on the wall.
>
> "Abeir-Toril" meant "The Cradle of Life", and that's was it. Pulling a whole
> planet out of the a** while doing no good to the original one is not my idea
> of "evolution" (and using children letter cubes as printing blocks so to
> cram - uhm - half of the info in twice the space didn't made things better).
>
> Maybe "It is easier! It is fun!" Dunno. For sure, the whole new approach "Is
> moronic!". And running the "old" FR is both easy and fun without the need to
> assume that IQ 35 is the new gamers' standard.
>
> They say that "the poet is someone able to put in words things that you
> already felt in your heart". For sure "Worlds in a Handful of Dice"'s review
> of the new FR literally stole the words from my mouth.
> http://nitessine.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/a-rant-and-a-review-forgotte...ealms-c
>
> Actually I'm a little bit ashamed, since I wanted to write my own review of
> this fiasco, but this one was better, clearer and more concise than anything
> I could come up with - so, there you go.
>
>

That is a really good article, thank you.

It also makes me glad that I am a diehard 3tard.

--
Tetsubo
--------------------------------------
"The apparent lesson of the Inquisition is that insistence on
uniformity of belief is fatal to intellectual, moral and spiritual health."
-The Uses Of The Past-, Herbert J. Muller

BLUP

Tetsubo <tetsubo.TakeThisOut@comcast.net> wrote:
> Patrick Baldwin wrote:
>>
>> Since the layoffs at WoTC, I've actually started keeping track of names of
>> contributors to 4ed and to the 4oroned Realms, sort of like I did with names
>> of people associated with 3.0. Then, it was so I could make sure to check
>> out what they did in the future. Now, it's so I can stay the hell away.
>
> Sort of a game designers Black List. I heartily approve.
>
> It saddens me that Mearls is now working on 4E material. But I guess we
> all have to eat. I'd just prefer he'd do porn. A much more expectable
> career move.

ITYM "respectable".

And have you *seen* Mearls? Gamer, in porn. You might want to rethink
this.

Although, compared to some of the men working porn now (Ron Jeremy
*cough*) he's not that bad looking. If he's got reasonable reliability
he might do okay.


Someone mentions an idea, I have to consider it. Yeah, it's a curse.


Keith
--
Keith Davies You know you're working too much when you
keith.davies.TakeThisOut@kjdavies.org receive spam with
keith.davies.TakeThisOut@gmail.com "Subject: Erection issues resolved!"
http://www.kjdavies.org/ and you go looking for the trouble ticket.

Keith Davies wrote:

> Tetsubo <tetsubo.RemoveThis@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>Patrick Baldwin wrote:
>>
>>>Since the layoffs at WoTC, I've actually started keeping track of names of
>>>contributors to 4ed and to the 4oroned Realms, sort of like I did with names
>>>of people associated with 3.0. Then, it was so I could make sure to check
>>>out what they did in the future. Now, it's so I can stay the hell away.
>>
>>Sort of a game designers Black List. I heartily approve.
>>
>>It saddens me that Mearls is now working on 4E material. But I guess we
>>all have to eat. I'd just prefer he'd do porn. A much more expectable
>>career move.
>
>
> ITYM "respectable".
>
> And have you *seen* Mearls? Gamer, in porn. You might want to rethink
> this.
>
> Although, compared to some of the men working porn now (Ron Jeremy
> *cough*) he's not that bad looking. If he's got reasonable reliability
> he might do okay.
>
>
> Someone mentions an idea, I have to consider it. Yeah, it's a curse.
>
>
> Keith

Regardless of what he looks like, porn would be more respectable than
writing 4E material. It would be more honest at least.

--
Tetsubo
--------------------------------------
"The apparent lesson of the Inquisition is that insistence on
uniformity of belief is fatal to intellectual, moral and spiritual health."
-The Uses Of The Past-, Herbert J. Muller

BLUP

Nel tempo Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:22:18 +0100, il mio fedele schiavo Wu
desto' nel mio animo interesse sopra il conversare di "Vincenzo
Beretta" <reckall RemoveThis @hotmail.com>:

>The only items I bought for 4E wre the new "Forgotten Realms". I mean (I
>thought) you can screw up a ruleset but not a *firmly established setting*
>uhu? Boy, the horror *_*

Come on, that's the Forgettable Realms. Nothing can make them worse
than they've always been.

Parvati V
--
"What is brain? Pai doesn't have such thing" - Pai, 3x3 eyes
UnaMoleDiDadi (TreEmme Torino): http://umdd.altervista.org/
http://parvatiquinta.blogspot.com/

"Parvati V" <parvatiquinta RemoveThis @email.it> wrote in message
news:tp44l4peko1vv8vv4mpvq3534vs1kvgkge@4ax.com...
> Nel tempo Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:22:18 +0100, il mio fedele schiavo Wu
> desto' nel mio animo interesse sopra il conversare di "Vincenzo
> Beretta" <reckall RemoveThis @hotmail.com>:
>
>>The only items I bought for 4E wre the new "Forgotten Realms". I mean (I
>>thought) you can screw up a ruleset but not a *firmly established setting*
>>uhu? Boy, the horror *_*
>
> Come on, that's the Forgettable Realms. Nothing can make them worse
> than they've always been.
>

They have always been a mishmash, but IMO that is just like the real world,
and that is what made the Realms interesting. Now they reduced the world so
it fits in the simple little box they designed, and in the process pissed
off alot of fans.

Shawn

> Parvati V
> --
> "What is brain? Pai doesn't have such thing" - Pai, 3x3 eyes
> UnaMoleDiDadi (TreEmme Torino): http://umdd.altervista.org/
> http://parvatiquinta.blogspot.com/

Shawn <shawn520 DeleteThis @telus.com> wrote:
>
> "Parvati V" <parvatiquinta DeleteThis @email.it> wrote in message
> news:tp44l4peko1vv8vv4mpvq3534vs1kvgkge@4ax.com...
>> Nel tempo Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:22:18 +0100, il mio fedele schiavo Wu
>> desto' nel mio animo interesse sopra il conversare di "Vincenzo
>> Beretta" <reckall DeleteThis @hotmail.com>:
>>
>>>The only items I bought for 4E wre the new "Forgotten Realms". I mean
>>>(I thought) you can screw up a ruleset but not a *firmly established
>>>setting* uhu? Boy, the horror *_*
>>
>> Come on, that's the Forgettable Realms. Nothing can make them worse
>> than they've always been.
>
> They have always been a mishmash, but IMO that is just like the real
> world, and that is what made the Realms interesting. Now they reduced
> the world so it fits in the simple little box they designed, and in
> the process pissed off alot of fans.

Ah, so staying true to their current marketing model.

Well, at least they're consistent.


Keith
--
Keith Davies You know you're working too much when you
keith.davies DeleteThis @kjdavies.org receive spam with
keith.davies DeleteThis @gmail.com "Subject: Erection issues resolved!"
http://www.kjdavies.org/ and you go looking for the trouble ticket.

"Keith Davies" <keith.davies.TakeThisOut@kjdavies.org> wrote in message
news:slrngl5vor.5uq.keith.davies@kjdavies.org...
> Shawn <shawn520.TakeThisOut@telus.com> wrote:
>>
>> "Parvati V" <parvatiquinta.TakeThisOut@email.it> wrote in message
>> news:tp44l4peko1vv8vv4mpvq3534vs1kvgkge@4ax.com...
>>> Nel tempo Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:22:18 +0100, il mio fedele schiavo Wu
>>> desto' nel mio animo interesse sopra il conversare di "Vincenzo
>>> Beretta" <reckall.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com>:
>>>
>>>>The only items I bought for 4E wre the new "Forgotten Realms". I mean
>>>>(I thought) you can screw up a ruleset but not a *firmly established
>>>>setting* uhu? Boy, the horror *_*
>>>
>>> Come on, that's the Forgettable Realms. Nothing can make them worse
>>> than they've always been.
>>
>> They have always been a mishmash, but IMO that is just like the real
>> world, and that is what made the Realms interesting. Now they reduced
>> the world so it fits in the simple little box they designed, and in
>> the process pissed off alot of fans.
>
> Ah, so staying true to their current marketing model.
>
> Well, at least they're consistent.
>
>
> Keith

Consistency isn't the problem; it's quality.


> --
> Keith Davies You know you're working too much when you
> keith.davies.TakeThisOut@kjdavies.org receive spam with
> keith.davies.TakeThisOut@gmail.com "Subject: Erection issues resolved!"
> http://www.kjdavies.org/ and you go looking for the trouble ticket.

Shawn wrote:
>
> "Keith Davies" <keith.davies.RemoveThis@kjdavies.org> wrote in message
> news:slrngl5vor.5uq.keith.davies@kjdavies.org...
>
>> Shawn <shawn520.RemoveThis@telus.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Parvati V" <parvatiquinta.RemoveThis@email.it> wrote in message
>>> news:tp44l4peko1vv8vv4mpvq3534vs1kvgkge@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>> Nel tempo Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:22:18 +0100, il mio fedele schiavo Wu
>>>> desto' nel mio animo interesse sopra il conversare di "Vincenzo
>>>> Beretta" <reckall.RemoveThis@hotmail.com>:
>>>>
>>>>> The only items I bought for 4E wre the new "Forgotten Realms". I mean
>>>>> (I thought) you can screw up a ruleset but not a *firmly established
>>>>> setting* uhu? Boy, the horror *_*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Come on, that's the Forgettable Realms. Nothing can make them worse
>>>> than they've always been.
>>>
>>>
>>> They have always been a mishmash, but IMO that is just like the real
>>> world, and that is what made the Realms interesting. Now they reduced
>>> the world so it fits in the simple little box they designed, and in
>>> the process pissed off alot of fans.
>>
>>
>> Ah, so staying true to their current marketing model.
>>
>> Well, at least they're consistent.
>>
>>
>> Keith
>
>
> Consistency isn't the problem; it's quality.

Where's the profit in quality?

>
>
>> --
>> Keith Davies You know you're working too much when you
>> keith.davies.RemoveThis@kjdavies.org receive spam with
>> keith.davies.RemoveThis@gmail.com "Subject: Erection issues resolved!"
>> http://www.kjdavies.org/ and you go looking for the trouble ticket.
>
>


--
Tetsubo
--------------------------------------
"The apparent lesson of the Inquisition is that insistence on
uniformity of belief is fatal to intellectual, moral and spiritual health."
-The Uses Of The Past-, Herbert J. Muller

BLUP

This message is not archived