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Since: Jan 10, 2007 Posts: 870
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:18 am
Post subject: Lowdown on Pentex Archived from groups: rec>games>trading-cards>jyhad (more info?)
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So, I'm pretty convinced that Pentex Subversion is good
(Thank you Matt Morgan and the continent of Europe). But I
need some coaching on it's placement in decks, and when/how
to use it.
For instance, should PS go in every deck? Blood Brothers
Combat? Enkidu combat? Guruhi ani/pre toolbox?
Pot/For/Dom? I mean really, every deck?
And in terms of usage, one thing that seems to always happen
is Pentex ends up in my hand (opening hand, gee thanks!).
And then I hold it and hold and hold it, waiting for the
"correct moment". That clogs my hand, but you never want to
discard it unless you might contest with someone else
(defensive contesting of Pentex could be a whole other
paragraph/thread). Or, I never see the darn thing all game.
I guess card cyclers like Ashurs and Hearts and Dreams
could help with that, hmmm.
The other thing, it seems whenever I'm holding Pentex, my
prey and pred are playing weenies, where PS is well-nigh
useless.
Anyway, I would love to hear folks expound on the all-mighty
Pentex Subversion. I know it's a game winner, I just need
to wrap my mind around it.
best -
chris
(considering just dropping a copy into every deck I have
running right now to see how it will work for me) |
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Since: Jul 14, 2009 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:44 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 24, 12:18 pm, librarian <aucti... DeleteThis @superfuncards.com> wrote:
> So, I'm pretty convinced that Pentex Subversion is good
> (Thank you Matt Morgan and the continent of Europe). But I
> need some coaching on it's placement in decks, and when/how
> to use it.
>
> For instance, should PS go in every deck? Blood Brothers
> Combat? Enkidu combat? Guruhi ani/pre toolbox?
> Pot/For/Dom? I mean really, every deck?
>
> And in terms of usage, one thing that seems to always happen
> is Pentex ends up in my hand (opening hand, gee thanks!).
> And then I hold it and hold and hold it, waiting for the
> "correct moment". That clogs my hand, but you never want to
> discard it unless you might contest with someone else
> (defensive contesting of Pentex could be a whole other
> paragraph/thread). Or, I never see the darn thing all game.
> I guess card cyclers like Ashurs and Hearts and Dreams
> could help with that, hmmm.
>
> The other thing, it seems whenever I'm holding Pentex, my
> prey and pred are playing weenies, where PS is well-nigh
> useless.
>
> Anyway, I would love to hear folks expound on the all-mighty
> Pentex Subversion. I know it's a game winner, I just need
> to wrap my mind around it.
>
> best -
>
> chris
> (considering just dropping a copy into every deck I have
> running right now to see how it will work for me)
Maybe every deck. I was just looking through the TWDA checking on the
usage of Pentex (*), and in the last 20 decks, there are 24 copies of
Pentex Subversion. 8 decks didn't have it, many others had multiple
copies. It seems like you might have the best luck running multiple
copies, so you don't have to worry about discarding it if it seems
like the wrong time. Often the decks running it also have one or more
copies of Anarch Troublemaker AND one or more copies of Misdirection
You can always use it to destroy someone who (foolishly) plays a
rockstar deck, or to powerbleed.
-Dave Clooney
* - Looking, because I hate Pentex, and wanted to see if it really had
become a "Must Play" card, as TTC claims -
http://ttcmaster.blogspot.com/2009/04/mercy-for-weak.html [I thought
must play cards were bad for the game..]
- Pentex subversion: the must-play card, present in a lot of modern
Jyhad decks. This card presents the advantage of not being restricted.
This is a master so cannot be blocked. This is possible to break it
but combat decks do not have so many friends. Also, playing pentex
subversion is strong because it can handle many different type of
decks at the same time. What does Pentex manage best:
star vampire combat (Una, count germaine, Enkidu, Beast...)
What does Pentex does not help against? weenie combat |
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Since: May 14, 2007 Posts: 44
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:59 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 24, 6:18 pm, librarian <aucti... DeleteThis @superfuncards.com> wrote:
> So, I'm pretty convinced that Pentex Subversion is good
> ...
> (considering just dropping a copy into every deck I have
> running right now to see how it will work for me)
For which decks is "Pentex Subversion" useful?
* Wall decks which can defend it (or make other players spent too many
actions trying to removing it). Effectively they take off one
opponent's vampires from the table.
* Decks that cannot circumvent a particular vampire or have other
problems getting by other vampires in general.
* Decks that want to fully go forward to maximize offensive
capabilities when going for the oust.
Against which decks is "Pentex Subversion" useful?
* Against star vampire decks (or decks that concentrate resources on a
vampire), where the assistant vampires are not able to remove the
Pentex easily.
In any case you need to afford the card, either you pool is plentiful
or you can defend your pool well. If you usually cannot afford the
"Pentex" (i.e. you will get ousted next turn) you can only play the
"Pentex" in the same turn where you (plan to) oust your prey. Hence
the often heard saying (at least in Europe), that "Pentex equals one
VP".
I wouldn't pack blindly one "Pentex" into every deck I play, the card
is costly and can be removed often easily by a large number of minions
or by stealth. There are decks in which multiple copies of the card
comes in handy (usually (Power-)Bleed decks like Edward Vignes or
Giovanni Powerbleed), and in this decks I would pack something like
2-4 "Pentex". Other decks don't need "Pentex Subversion" or it is even
not even remotefully helpful (e.g. Cel Gun).
Best Regards, Ralf
====================
http://extrala.blogspot.com |
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Since: Jun 26, 2005 Posts: 1811
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2009 12:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 24, 12:18 pm, librarian <aucti... RemoveThis @superfuncards.com> wrote:
> So, I'm pretty convinced that Pentex Subversion is good
> (Thank you Matt Morgan and the continent of Europe). But I
> need some coaching on it's placement in decks, and when/how
> to use it.
Yeah, Pentex is one of those cards that every time your opponent plays
it, you say "For frack's sake. I hate that stupid card." And every
other game, you are like "Man. If only I had a Pentex in my hand right
now, I'd be winning..."
It is probably one of the most "need to use in every deck" cards in
the game. And one of the biggest flaws with any strategy that relies
on a single minion for whatever reason--yeah, superstar decks are
totally hosed, but I just lost a JOL game (which I think you were
in  'cause I had a single minion with +3 permacept and a hand full
of untap, so I could probably survive my S+B predator's turn. And then
he played Pentex. Game over.
> For instance, should PS go in every deck? Blood Brothers
> Combat? Enkidu combat? Guruhi ani/pre toolbox?
> Pot/For/Dom? I mean really, every deck?
It certainly *can* go in every deck. Having one in any deck that is
vulnerable to it is always a good plan. Having one in any deck that is
concerned about being blocked is a good idea. I tend to put one in
every potentially competitive deck. I put 2 or 3 in decks that can
really benefit from it, like tap and bleed or weenie horde bleed decks
or whatever, where being able to put a hole in my prey's defenses is
often a game winner.
> And in terms of usage, one thing that seems to always happen
> is Pentex ends up in my hand (opening hand, gee thanks!).
> And then I hold it and hold and hold it, waiting for the
> "correct moment". That clogs my hand, but you never want to
> discard it unless you might contest with someone else
> (defensive contesting of Pentex could be a whole other
> paragraph/thread). Or, I never see the darn thing all game.
> I guess card cyclers like Ashurs and Hearts and Dreams
> could help with that, hmmm.
Well, ya know, that is the problem with all cards that you have one of
in your deck that you want mid-late game. They are always in your
opening hand. How often do you have Giant's Blood in your opening
hand, and then end up playing to gain, like, 2 blood just to use it
before someone else does? Early Pentex can be handy in slowing down
your prey and getting some free hits in if you don't want to hold on
to it forever. But really, what makes Pentex good is when you play it
and it makes you win right then.
> (considering just dropping a copy into every deck I have
> running right now to see how it will work for me)
Totally worthwhile plan. I mean, no one ever likes seeing it, like DI,
but if you wanna see what it does, put one in all your decks.
-Peter |
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Since: Sep 20, 2009 Posts: 7
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:16 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 24 nov, 18:18, librarian <aucti....TakeThisOut@superfuncards.com> wrote:
> So, I'm pretty convinced that Pentex Subversion is good
> (Thank you Matt Morgan and the continent of Europe). But I
> need some coaching on it's placement in decks, and when/how
> to use it.
>
> For instance, should PS go in every deck? Blood Brothers
> Combat? Enkidu combat? Guruhi ani/pre toolbox?
> Pot/For/Dom? I mean really, every deck?
>
> And in terms of usage, one thing that seems to always happen
> is Pentex ends up in my hand (opening hand, gee thanks!).
> And then I hold it and hold and hold it, waiting for the
> "correct moment". That clogs my hand, but you never want to
> discard it unless you might contest with someone else
> (defensive contesting of Pentex could be a whole other
> paragraph/thread). Or, I never see the darn thing all game.
> I guess card cyclers like Ashurs and Hearts and Dreams
> could help with that, hmmm.
>
> The other thing, it seems whenever I'm holding Pentex, my
> prey and pred are playing weenies, where PS is well-nigh
> useless.
>
> Anyway, I would love to hear folks expound on the all-mighty
> Pentex Subversion. I know it's a game winner, I just need
> to wrap my mind around it.
>
> best -
>
> chris
> (considering just dropping a copy into every deck I have
> running right now to see how it will work for me)
Dear Chris,
there´s a city in Spain named Cordoba, where Pentex Subversion has
become a religious belief. Each cordobes player has at least 2 pentex
in every deck they have.
It´s really a shady thing how they play!!!
bests,
Dr.Mafrune |
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Since: Jul 08, 2005 Posts: 713
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:25 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Peter D Bakija schrieb:
> It is probably one of the most "need to use in every deck" cards in
> the game. And one of the biggest flaws with any strategy that relies
> on a single minion for whatever reason--yeah, superstar decks are
> totally hosed, but I just lost a JOL game (which I think you were
> in 'cause I had a single minion with +3 permacept and a hand full
> of untap, so I could probably survive my S+B predator's turn. And then
> he played Pentex. Game over.
For that exact reason I like Pentex: it is a wall breaker (sometimes). |
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Since: Jun 26, 2005 Posts: 1811
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:59 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 25, 1:06 pm, "Frederick Scott" <nos... DeleteThis @no.spam.dot.com> wrote:
> Hmmm. Maybe a hand with a fair amount of untap and one Sudden Reversal
> would have been better?
Indeed, it would have been. Or an opponent with a hand full of not
Pentex Subversion. Or having dominate and bounce in hand. Or any
number of other things. But that wasn't the example...
-Peter |
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Since: Jul 05, 2005 Posts: 1051
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 11:06 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Peter D Bakija" <pdb6.DeleteThis@lightlink.com> wrote in message
news:53788e86-40f3-4c8c-a4b5-cbbdd85ccc85@v37g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...
> It is probably one of the most "need to use in every deck" cards in
> the game. And one of the biggest flaws with any strategy that relies
> on a single minion for whatever reason--yeah, superstar decks are
> totally hosed, but I just lost a JOL game (which I think you were
> in 'cause I had a single minion with +3 permacept and a hand full
> of untap, so I could probably survive my S+B predator's turn. And then
> he played Pentex. Game over.
Hmmm. Maybe a hand with a fair amount of untap and one Sudden Reversal
would have been better?
Fred |
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Since: Nov 26, 2009 Posts: 6
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 2:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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For me the question is not if I use Pentex, but how many of them
Same goes for 99,99% of the players in my playgroup. Sometimes it
actually gets anoying.
To be honest Pentex is a card I love and hate at the same time. |
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Since: Jun 28, 2005 Posts: 617
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 1:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 09:18:13 -0800, librarian <auctions.DeleteThis@superfuncards.com>
wrote:
> Anyway, I would love to hear folks expound on the all-mighty Pentex
> Subversion. I know it's a game winner, I just need to wrap my mind
> around it.
>
> best -
>
> chris
> (considering just dropping a copy into every deck I have running right
> now to see how it will work for me)
There was a joke in our local playgroup that went something like this:
Q: What's the difference between a fun play deck and a tournament deck?
A: 2 Direct Interventions, and a Pentex.
--
Regards,
Daneel |
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Since: Oct 23, 2009 Posts: 26
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Pentex is one of the most overpowered cards in the game. Easy top 3 of
most powerful cards. |
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Since: Jul 05, 2005 Posts: 1051
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:58 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Raziel" <angelofcain RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:84e04bf0-eef7-4bb8-a22a-520510216a6f@m25g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
> Pentex is one of the most overpowered cards in the game. Easy top 3 of
> most powerful cards.
If that's true, how come no "BAN PENTEX" threads?!? Not even one!
Bah! A card can't be overpowered unless some sore loser wants to take
out his frustration on it in a thread come Monday morning. |
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Since: Oct 23, 2009 Posts: 26
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:52 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 30 Lis, 15:58, "Frederick Scott" <nos....TakeThisOut@no.spam.dot.com> wrote:
> "Raziel" <angelofc....TakeThisOut@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:84e04bf0-eef7-4bb8-a22a-520510216a6f@m25g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Pentex is one of the most overpowered cards in the game. Easy top 3 of
> > most powerful cards.
>
> If that's true, how come no "BAN PENTEX" threads?!? Not even one!
>
> Bah! A card can't be overpowered unless some sore loser wants to take
> out his frustration on it in a thread come Monday morning.
American players underestimate pentex, european players just play the
game - with all possible combination of cards, and most powerful cards
- after all, all meths can play pentex - so every player have equal
chances. |
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Since: Apr 27, 2007 Posts: 68
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Howdy Fred,
On Nov 30, 6:58 am, "Frederick Scott" <nos....RemoveThis@no.spam.dot.com> wrote:
> "Raziel" <angelofc....RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:84e04bf0-eef7-4bb8-a22a-520510216a6f@m25g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Pentex is one of the most overpowered cards in the game. Easy top 3 of
> > most powerful cards.
>
> If that's true, how come no "BAN PENTEX" threads?!? Not even one!
Well, it's not a thread, but try 'ban pentex author:wumpus' in the
'Search Groups' box on Google...
> Bah! A card can't be overpowered unless some sore loser wants to take
> out his frustration on it in a thread come Monday morning.
I'm on the cutting edge of frustration, as usual.
Alex |
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Since: Jun 26, 2005 Posts: 545
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 3:22 am
Post subject: Re: Lowdown on Pentex [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Frederick Scott wrote:
> "Raziel" <angelofcain RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
>> Pentex is one of the most overpowered cards in the game.
>> Easy top 3 of most powerful cards.
>
> If that's true, how come no "BAN PENTEX" threads?!? Not even one!
It might be more correct to say that Pentex is *undercosted*.
Which, by my definition, doesn't often rise to the level of eratta/ban.
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Please visit VTESville daily! http://vtesville.myminicity.com/
Please buy my cards! http://shop.ebay.com/kjmergen/m.html |
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